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DON’T TALK TO CONDI
Douglas Wood, held hostage in Iraq, has apparently been beaten by his captors:
Through a badly beaten face Mr Wood can be heard saying: “Move out of Iraq or I will be killed.”
Wood is 63 years old. These “insurgents” are real tough guys, aren’t they? I bet Wood could take all of them if he wasn’t tied up. Meanwhile, the SMH’s Paul McGeough believes Australian foreign minister Alexander Downer should cancel meetings with US officials in order to pacify terrorist scum:
Potentially the most damaging was Downer’s meeting before the cameras with the US Secretary of State, Condoleezza Rice, and his public announcement that he would be meeting the US Vice-President, Dick Cheney, in Washington yesterday.
From the insurgents’ point of view, he conveyed the message that he was consorting with their enemy.
We are a free people. We’ll talk to whomever we please. If McGeough doesn’t like it, perhaps he should return to chatting with those two chaps who told him they saw Ayad Illawi shooting prisoners.
UPDATE. Andrew Bolt:
These terrorists misunderstand Australians completely, and by their threats have made us more resolute, not less. Well, most of us, anyway. But more on the despicable Greens later.
UPDATE II. Richard McEnroe in comments: “Waitaminit. I thought Bob Ellis said Condi didn’t scare anybody.”
Bob’s column ended: “You see if I am right.” As usual, he isn’t.
Good Lord, these are Aussies, not Spanish! Why in the world would anyone think the foreign minister from Australia should cower like that? Are thee not men???
Posted by Kathy from Austin on 2005 05 07 at 04:03 PM • permalinkYou are consorting with their enemies… and thank you. You should be proud of that.
Any chance of organizing a Whip McGeough Through the Streets Day?
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2005 05 07 at 06:03 PM • permalinkoh, how nice it is to see the cowards twirl when condi comes a callin’. what to do ? what to say? better hit the snub button..
Ihave very high hopes for the new Australia, she’s an awesome country and just like Canada is about to see some big changes in her politcal landscape.
Bloggers like you are a national treasure and will make a huge difference in the lives of people years from now.
Great job!!
Waitaminit. I thought Bob Ellis said Condi didn’t scare anybody. What is McHeough so het up about?000
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2005 05 07 at 07:00 PM • permalinkI’m sending up prayers for Mr. Wood and his poor, traumatized family, but there is little hope in this life. These sociopaths rarely let their hostages go for any reason (unless they are female Italian communists who agree to write damning diatribes against the coalition forces, and the West in general).
The only way to stop these bastards is to catch them and put them in cages, or failing that, kill them all.
I know which option I prefer.
THe thing that sickens me is that poor Mr Woods execution will be downloaded by every islamic Jihad scum in the western world and they will sit, rejoice and watch it and praise allah for the murder.
I still remember the chilling cries as the perpetrators of the madrid bombings yelled in ecstasy at Nick Berg’s execution whilst being monitored by italian intelligence.
My prayers are with Mr Woods in this terrible moment of darkness and i hope he can shout or do something like the brave Italian at the last moment to show those scum that Australians are not coawards.I think there should be a powerful response should these cowards murder Mr Woods.
Sending more troops would be a nice interim response, but something far more powerful needs to be done.
I have just finished reading thru the Koran again. One notable thing: it implies that an evil man can attain paradise (heaven). This is very odd, but it seems true. A man can devote his life to unprovoked invasion of and agression against his fellow man, slaughter them all, men, women and children, steal, rape, and lie, and yet be acclaimed ‘just’ and ‘good’. They just have to be non-Muslims, or Muslims of a stripe different to him.
I know of no other major religion which regards cold blooded murder, theft, lies and rape as ‘good’, let alone a sanctified act.
SO, if Mr Woods is murdered, I would like to see a government funded think-tank established for Koranic criticism, to critically examine and review the Koran and Hadith in exactly the same manner the Bible is critically reviewed and criticised. And to publish its criticisms widely - in Arabic.
Some have suggested that Islam is not actually a religion at all, as it is expressed presently by elements of the Arab world. Having lived in a south east asian Muslim nation, I would not agree that Islam is not a religion there, but I would agree that certain Arab views could endanger Islam’s religious status in those countries. The endless Arab and Turkic Islamic aggression over the last 1400 years, and this present, outright, evil rejoicing in the murder of the helpless lend some credence to this view of a cancer in the Islamic Arab religious world.
How can a cold-blooded murderer not be an evil man? How can an evil man obtain salvation?
I think that this type of response would be far more powerful an answer than anything else. Such a think tank would tend to arm the genuinely religious against those perverting their religion.
MarkL
Canberratwo notes:
firstly, rfid technology is possible but only for your pets? look it up! Why anyone would travel and work in Iraq without a breadcrumb trail escapes me. Theyre the size of a grain of rice and go global!secondly, do not be confused with Islam and Marx. The militants don’t carry islamic AK’s.
I remember trying to convince a college prof that marxism was a religion but seeing as he was a drug casuality convert my wizard tales didnt faze him. Most westerners either havent heard the gospel, think its cute or just play along to get laid. Imagine living in a place where the only alternatives were marx and the quran!
Also, remember that all the smart ones were murdered or hid their true faith.So when you hear the massline that these are ‘muslims’ its just a switch to hide the fact that most of the arabic dictat were euro educated and commie-fied. They won’t even print the full name of the baathist party.
I went to one of my liberal sister’s collge parties in DC once and they actually had a banner that said “Victory for Africa through scientific socialism” I laughed in their faces, and drank all their beer..
MarkL there is a misconception that Islam is a peaceful loving religion and the terrorists are a few ‘bad apples’ - wrong, like Marxism its the whole kit and caboodle with violence and detah interwoven throughout.
Sounds a bit strong?
Koran 8:12 “Your Lord inspired the angels with the message: ‘I am with you. Give firmness to the Believers. I will terrorize the unbelievers. Therefore smite them on their necks and every joint and incapacitate them. Strike off their heads and cut off each of their fingers and toes.�
Koran 8:39 “So, fight them till all opposition ends and the only religion is Islam.�
Koran 8:59 “The infidels should not think that they can get away from us. Prepare against them whatever arms and weaponry you can muster so that you may terrorize them. They are your enemy and Allah’s enemy.�
This is sanctified genocide.
From the insurgents’ point of view, he conveyed the message that he was consorting with their enemy.
Odd, I’m sure from Downer’s point of view he was meeting with an ally.
Posted by Patrick Chester on 2005 05 07 at 11:30 PM • permalinkThe Telegraph (UK) reports that No. 3 is proving hard to crack-
Al-Libbi had been beaten and injected with the so-called “truth drug”, sodium pentothal, said the official. “They have tried all possible methods, from the ‘third degree’ to injecting him with a truth serum but it is hard to break him,” he said.
They’re on the wrong track. All they need to is give him a shot of sodium pentothal (which is only an anaesthetic anyway) and stick him naked in a spa at the Sheraton with 72 virgins (well, 72 cheap hookers will do - he wouldn’t know the difference) and soon he’ll be singing like a bird.
Posted by walterplinge on 2005 05 08 at 12:17 AM • permalinkOf course we’re consorting with their enemy, we ARE their enemy.
And Christianity has a get out of jail free card, tell God you’re sorry. Besides which the Bible is full of barbaric acts, some God himself apparntly ordered. Sensible Christians ignore that shit, but I’ve still no time for any religion.
Posted by Aging Gamer on 2005 05 08 at 03:50 AM • permalinkRog2 mentioned a few of the Koran’s edicts. here’s a few more .. Kill the disbelievers wherever we find them. (2:191)
Fight and slay the pagans (translation: that’s us) seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem. (9:5)
Slay or crucify or cut the hands and feet of the unbelievers…(5:34)
...strike off the heads of the disbelievers…[make a] wide slaughter among them, carefully tie up the remaining captives [for ransom] (947:4)
[treatment of disbelievers]...garments of fire shall be cut and there shall be poured over their heads boiling water whereby whatever is in their bowels and skin shall be dissolved and they will be punished with hooked iron rods (22:19).The Koran also instructs Muslims to slay or crucify or cut the hands and the feet of the unbelievers (5:34), fight unbelievers until no other religion except Islam remains. (3:85)
And people think Southern U.S.A Baptists are harsh!Posted by Lucky Nutsacks on 2005 05 08 at 04:19 AM • permalinkSorry about the long post above. I’ve been taking instructions from Dunlop and Lambert. Lots of words = good apparently.
Posted by Lucky Nutsacks on 2005 05 08 at 04:24 AM • permalinkFor what it’s worth ... (dead-set, die-hard anti-supernaturalists needn’t waste their time reading this) the story of Mohammed’s first encounter with the entity he subsequently claimed was the angel Gabriel is interesting. Apparently it seized him and squeezed the breath out of him three times. Each time it commanded him to read even though he was illiterate. He thought he’d either gone mad or been afflicted by a demon and went home scared to death. After telling his wife what had happened she said that he would be a prophet. For the following three years he was suicidally depressed. See http://answering-islam.org.uk/Silas/suicide.htm
The story is interesting to me because the chest squeezing thing is traditionally associated with demonic activity (incubi, succubi, old hag and various other names from all over the world). These days scientific rationalists put these experiences down to a disorder they call sleep paralysis but there’s a variant in Zanzibar that leaves its male victims all beaten up which is hardly the sort of thing you’re likely to do to yourself while paralysed.
Having had my own brush with some very, very strange stuff while wide awake and completely unaffected by hallucinogenic substances I’m willing to consider the possibility that maybe sometimes when these things happen there’s more going on than a mere biochemical abnormality or some neurons not synapsing properly. And when the outcome is a religious system that, as Mark L points out at #16, “regards cold blooded murder, theft, lies and rape as ‘good’” then maybe it’s not unreasonable to suspect that the ultimate author of this system is the one who was described as “the father of lies” and “a murderer from the beginning”. (John 8:44)
Regardless of the origins (or even hearsay origins) of islam I think it is still a bit of a long bow to say that muslims will all act like a blood sucking terrorist given even a small chance.
Most of them are real people after all, just like us.
That said, I find the bethnall green electorate outcome very depressing. That so many muslims would vote for Galloway would suggest my above sincere wish may not be true.
Incidently, What sort of a cold, calculating bastard is George Galloway? This scottish pinko came to London and stood in an electorate with a large muslim population against a black jewish woman.
Anyway, none of that was why I was posting….What I want to know is, what is Howard planning to do if these nut jobs do assasinate one of our citizens? Should Tim start a sweep on the number of additional troops Australia will send in response?
The Bethnal Green and Bow result is the single most damaging threat to race - properly, religious - relations since Enoch Powell’s river of blood speech and the rise of the NF in the 1970s. Those of us who seek to show that Muslim extremists are the exception, not the rule, and that mainstream Muslims pose no threat to Western democracy, have been dealt a severe blow.
Until Galloway’s result - based on demagoguery and the idea that there is indeed a fundamental split between the Muslim way of thinking and that of non-Muslims - it was possible to argue convincingly, as I have sought to do, that maintream Muslims had nothing in common with the extremists.
But the Bethnal Green and Bow result makes that argument very difficult. Galloway did not win because he was supported by a small number of Muslim extremists - those who clearly pose a threat to the West and have to be imprisoned. He won because of support from precisely those mainstream Muslims whom I, and others, have argued did not support their militant brothers.
I cannot bear to think this, since the repercussions are so frightening, but what if that view is wrong? What if - as the vote seems to show - it is not just extremists but mainstream Muslims, too, who have views which are incompatible with Western democracy? Respect/SWP supports the right of terrorists to murder Iraqis. And Respect/SWP has now won the support of maintream Muslim opinion in Bethnal Green and Bow.
If the conclusion is that there is indeed a split between mainstream Muslim opinion and western norms, then the repercussions for community harmony and race relations are likely to be dire.
from Silent Running
http://silentrunning.tv/Most of them are real people after all, just like us.
Sorry entropy, you cut me out of islam, I find no empathy with a belief that proscribes death to non believers.
You dont have to be a christian to follow and respect the christian principles. Ditto with judaism - many jews are agnostic or atheist.
Islam is the nazi of beliefs.
Blogstrop,
the view of many informed people is that there is in essence no moderate or mainstream Islam.
THe people who hold this view are not raving fascists , but those who have made in depth studies of the History of Islam and the Koran.
Galloway’s win may indeed be the canary in the coal mine of Britain.
But the Brits and the europeans have taken the path of multiculturism, a path that has functioned admirably for all immigrant cultures except it seems, for some Muslims.
The errors of misunderstanding Islam may yet cost them dearly.‘Of course we’re consorting with their enemy, we ARE their enemy. And Christianity has a get out of jail free card, tell God you’re sorry. Besides which the Bible is full of barbaric acts, some God himself apparntly ordered. Sensible Christians ignore that shit, but I’ve still no time for any religion.’
Go ahead and ignore that ‘shit’.
And we’ll ignore your shit.
And who cares what you’ve got time for.
Fear and ignorance are powerful tools of people like Galloway, make any supposed threat loom large enough and the people will take cover.
The left has been making that argument with Bush/Howard/Blair and co for years.
Posted by Aging Gamer on 2005 05 08 at 07:28 AM • permalinkExodus 21 isn’t a pile of shit to modern day Christians?
I never knew.
Posted by Aging Gamer on 2005 05 08 at 07:48 AM • permalinkBlogstrop, when you quote other peoples’ material could you please use quotation mark or the “quote” buttons here? Thank you. And Aging Gamer, please stop with the Christian bashing. Christians follow the New Testament, which has not a word about smiting unbelievers.
Posted by Andrea Harris, Administrator on 2005 05 08 at 10:50 AM • permalinkMore details on the “Religion of Peace”‘s <a href=“http://www.rogerlsimon.com/”>
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2005 05 08 at 12:21 PM • permalinkLet’s try that again… I was distracted by seeing my name in updates. Mucho bonus points with Our Dark Master Rove…
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2005 05 08 at 12:26 PM • permalinkI’m not bashing Christians, I’m saying just because it’s in a holy text, doesn’t mean we do it. New Testament aside, you don’t see Jews selling their daughters as sex slaves.
My point is humanity for the most part has progressed beyond that, I suspect a lot of Muslims feel the same way.
Posted by Aging Gamer on 2005 05 08 at 12:49 PM • permalinkAging Gamer, the difference lies in interpretation. All Christians know that the Bible (both Testaments) was written by men. Check out the Gospels; they tend to start with a clue about this (The Gospel according to {insert some bloke’s name here}).
SO they were written by men, and this is made plain, sowe can argue, interpret, discard things that might have been OK 2000 years ago but seem a tad dated now (what bastards the Romans are, for example), So Christians tend to be a fractitious, argumentative lot. Jews are too, we inherit a lot by them, but there arguments are even more fun, because they have had a couple of thousand more years to work on ‘em.
The Koran was also written by men, mostly to justify unprovoked aggression against and conquest of their neighbours. Not to mention justifying mysogeny, that which we now label paedopilia, and a lot of other stuff like rape, murder, torture, slavery etc. Sensible folk raised as Muslims try to ignore all this stuff - they are not out to conquer Christian Syria these days when living in Surabaya.
The problem is that wahabism insists that the Koran was not written by men at all (it was), that no other versions exist (they do) and that it was written directly by Allah. This being so, they argue every word must be followed literally (but they will do any interpretation, thanks very much).
This is why serious Koranic criticism is anathema to them, it undercuts their personal power base and their version of a barbarian hell that places them at the top of the (secular) power structure.
Nice folks, these.
MarkL
CanberraIn my time I’ve met plenty of Christians who told me that the Bible was written by God through man. Like a diehard moonbat they are immune to logic, immune to any sort of counter point, whatever the Bible says is it for them. You end up with Creationists who say that dinosaurs were planted here by satan to trick us.
Now, for the sane Christians, does this lunatic fringe have any real impact on their lives? It doesn’t, and that’s the trick, one which needs to be copied the world over. Freedom and prosperity are vital parts of this, which brings us to now doesn’t it.
Posted by Aging Gamer on 2005 05 08 at 11:55 PM • permalink43, in your time you’re an idiot.
‘In my time I’ve met plenty of Christians who told me that the Bible was written by God through man.’
Divine inspiration? Forget it. Number 43 has spoken.
‘Freedom and prosperity’?
Are you serious?
Like they wouldn’t be characteristics of Christian societies the world over, as against ...
...ah forget it, the argument is not worth having.
You’re right, it’s not worth having an argument as you’re completely missing what I’m saying, rather you choose to spit vemon at some phantom hatred I have for anyone with a belief.
Here, I’ll spell it out for you:
Modern Christian Society = GOOD
So damn good it should (if it isn’t already) be a template for the rest of the world.
Posted by Aging Gamer on 2005 05 09 at 10:13 AM • permalinkah forget it, the argument is not worth having
You are not even attempting to argue, you are merely frothing at the mouth as a result of a perceived criticism of your faith.
Andrea: if it’s open season on Islam here but Christianity is out of bounds, perhaps you need to put up discussion guidelines that we can read before deciding to join.
‘Ageing gamer’, you’ve admitted you have no time for any religion.
And you used the word ‘shit’ twice in relation to the Bible.
And now you are ‘spelling out’ - idiotically - that you believe Modern Christian Society (your capitals) ‘= Good’.
So yes, you are an idiot.
And whoever called for ‘discussion guidelines’ should go back to kindergarten.
I have no time for car racing either, I find it completely boring. Am I ready to burn the entire thing to the ground? No. Do I want to see it stopped? No.
Reason I have no time for religion is the same as that old insult towards NZ, it’d be great if it wasn’t for the people. You’re proving that point all by yourself.
And yes there’s “shit” in the Bible, there’s “shit” in everything. There’s “shit” in Resident Evil 4, does that stop it being one of the best (if not the best) game the GameCube has (or at the very least, the best the series has ever produced)? No.
Query: Are you out stoning wizards and mediums? You’re not are you, neither are other Christians, otherwise LiveJournals (and DeadJournals for the super trendy) wouldn’t be full of Wiccans and vampires.
Leviticus 20:27 - “A man or a woman who is a medium or a wizard shall be put to death; they shall be stoned with stones, their blood shall be upon them.”
Rather then go for that stuff, sane people do things like follow the Ten Commandments, codes of conduct if you will. They take inspiration from the story of Moses leading his people to freedom, from Jesus and his unwavering belief that there’s a better way, the good bits.
My point is if mainstream Islam can follow that line of thinking (crazy “kill all infidels” ignored; good honest stuff adhered to) and shake off the influence of the fundamentalists (as mainstream Christianity has done) then everyone wins… well, except the fundamentalists, but that’s kinda the point.
Now, a word on tactics, if you ever engage the left don’t form imaginary contructs of extremism around everything they say (they’re quite capable of doing that themselves *barumbump ching*) then howl at the top of your lungs, you may scare the lesser warriors away, but the experienced ones will simply laugh and you’ll embarrass us all.
Posted by Aging Gamer on 2005 05 10 at 11:46 AM • permalink
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The terrorists remain barbaric bastards and cowards.
McGeough remains an unmitigated idiot.